|
Post by Retired Coach on Oct 17, 2014 20:49:39 GMT -5
Another basketball player arrested? What the heck is going on with our program??? Grant needs to sack up and send Donlon packing and if he isn't willing to do it, Hopkins needs to get rid of Grant too. This is the 4th arrest since last season and 7th in Donlon's brief tenure as a head coach.
|
|
|
Post by wsumandy on Oct 17, 2014 22:28:08 GMT -5
No longer an isolated incident, right?
|
|
|
Post by Tipp City Raider on Oct 17, 2014 22:36:42 GMT -5
No longer an isolated incident, right? No one claimed this was an isolated incident.
|
|
|
Post by wsutommygun on Oct 17, 2014 22:51:00 GMT -5
I am a one day at a time person so, I take these incidents the same way. I personally don't think it is fair to connect the dots but, if it makes you happy, cast the first stone. Back in the day, I knew W.O. Wright's was a problem spot for WSU ( should I say local college players ). A coach would be called and that was the end of it ( call it special treatment or different times...no camera phones to catch what was going on ). I don't have a problem with someone fussing but, if you have a problem with guys like Vaughn or JT and their parents then you really aren't paying attention. I'd take the character of last year's squad over any other HL team ( don't know the new guys well enough but, I'll bet I'll be proud they chose to be Raiders ). These moments of acting like a knucklehead will be a problem with auto insurance. Perhaps some day they'll have to explain it to potential employers, or potential spouses and their families.
|
|
|
Post by Retired Coach on Oct 17, 2014 23:13:40 GMT -5
I am a one day at a time person so, I take these incidents the same way. I personally don't think it is fair to connect the dots but, if it makes you happy, cast the first stone. Back in the day, I knew W.O. Wright's was a problem spot for WSU ( should I say local college players ). A coach would be called and that was the end of it ( call it special treatment or different times...no camera phones to catch what was going on ). I don't have a problem with someone fussing but, if you have a problem with guys like Vaughn or JT and their parents then you really aren't paying attention. I'd take the character of last year's squad over any other HL team ( don't know the new guys well enough but, I'll bet I'll be proud they chose to be Raiders ). These moments of acting like a knucklehead will be a problem with auto insurance. Perhaps some day they'll have to explain it to potential employers, or potential spouses and their families. I think it is very fair to connect the dots. Donlon has been our head coach 4 years now and he has SEVEN arrests under his belt and it isn't just the drinking. We have 2 underage consumption arrests, 2 DUI arrests, 1 shoplifting arrest, 1 domestic violence arrest, and 1 illegal firearm arrest. You are right that in different times athletes got special treatment. Just because athletes got away with illegal activity in the past does not mean it was right then and it sure in the heck does not mean that it should be acceptable now. Once again, Donlon's players have been arrested SEVEN times in the 4 years he has been head coach. I don't think we have had a total of 7 arrests in the 23 years prior to Donlon's tenure since we went D1. If you want to stick with the argument that it doesn't matter because athletes used to do the same thing in the past but got preferential treatment, compare Donlon's tenure to his current peers. If you add up all of the players that have been in trouble throughout the entire HL over the last 4 years, I don't think there has been 7 other arrests. I care about our men's basketball team, but more importantly I care about the image of my alma mater. This is not acceptable.
|
|
|
Post by wsutommygun on Oct 18, 2014 7:14:16 GMT -5
Class of '79, I can't control how you feel about your alma mater but, when I visit the main campus, I am impressed with the changes and amazed at some of the things going on.
We may just have to disagree about the state of the basketball program. When I read where WSU staff or faculty are arrested, I don't lump everyone together...I don't blame President Hopkins for being responsible. I certainly don't dwell on letting it effect my image of WSU.
I still prefer to break down each incident on its own merits ( otherwise, Lett would walk into a courtroom and get blamed for everything any student-athlete has done ). If you don't like Donlon, say you don't like Donlon. Otherwise, let's get started.
|
|
|
Post by bballraider on Oct 18, 2014 11:43:09 GMT -5
It's hard for me to blame the coach for these events, as most occur in the off season during summer when the kids have more free time and the coaching is limited. But to blame the coaches for this isn't fair, as these kids need to learn to make right choices on their own. Parents have the same issues with their kids. You teach them right from wrong, but I guarantee you when on their own in certain circumstances, the kids will still make bad choices. It's how all the parties deal with it that matters.
Remember these are still kids away from home, and I know I wasn't very mature at their age and did things I regret now. But part of growing up is making mistakes and learning from them. It's how you respond to some adversity that determines what kind of person you will be later in life.
As far as other teams, hard to compare because every campus environment is different. Maybe on other campuses the kids can walk every where, so obviously no drunk driving, that doesn't mean their not drinking, just means they are not put in a position to make a very bad choice to drive. Wright State is more sprawling with many students off campus, so the opportunity to have their judgment impaired may be higher than other locations.
|
|
|
Post by Retired Coach on Oct 18, 2014 12:54:43 GMT -5
If you don't like Donlon, say you don't like Donlon. Otherwise, let's get started. I don't like Donlon, but that has nothing to do with my opinion on this matter. A good coach is like a good parent. You set an example and when needed you lay down the law so kids know the consequences of their actions. We have had 7 arrests since Donlon took over. What has Donlon done after any of those arrests to make the team know that this isn't acceptable behavior? Duggins got a 2 game suspension. That's not much of a deterrent considering Sledge got the same type of suspension for skipping class. Nothing happened to Darkwa after his shoplifting arrest. He transferred to another school at the end of the quarter. I am sure our coaches encouraged that to happen but they could have made a statement and actually kicked him out of school to send a message to the rest of the team that we don't tolerate that here at WSU. Sledge was suspended from the team last year for double digit games but our coaches didn't really have a choice in the matter. He was in jail so they didn't have the ability to play him even if they wanted to. I have no doubt that they would have played him earlier in the season if they could have. They did try to get his jail time decreased with the judge for crying out loud. If Donlon would have done the right thing back then and kicked Sledge off the team, we wouldn't have had to go through the embarrassment of a second arrest of Sledge this year. Mark Howell was the first of this new string of drinking related arrests and he was arrested back in April. If Donlon would have dropped the hammer on him then, maybe we could have avoided the last 2 drinking arrests. I get that college kids are going to do stupid things sometimes. Every program is going to have a black eye every now and then. My point is that many of these incidents could have been avoided if Donlon had set a better example. Our players either don't fear what Donlon will do to them if they make bad decisions or they don't respect him enough to care how these poor decisions reflect on him/WSU.
|
|
|
Post by Raider Country on Oct 18, 2014 13:15:05 GMT -5
I don't necessarily think Donlon should be fired over this but I think he hasn't done nearly enough to prevent these incidents. The thought of being suspended a game or 2 obviously hasn't worked as a deterrent. Maybe our AD needs to step in and establish some real punishments for athletes that break the law. Athletes are representatives of the university if they like it or not. They are being given a free education for representing the university. They are held to higher standards than the rest of the student body. Maybe we need to go to an extreme and tell our athletes that if you get arrested, you lose your scholarship for a year. If you stay out of trouble and behave like a good citizen you can earn it back the following year. I think our athletes will think very hard about the decisions they make if there are some real consequences to their actions.
|
|
|
Post by wsutommygun on Oct 18, 2014 13:17:11 GMT -5
I think Tavares got a raw deal on his 2013 incident. I think he deserved another chance.
Maybe it is your intention to discourage players and their families from coming to Wright State. I offer a counter point for them to consider and that would be the Vest family. Mark ( as a former all-time great ) probably has more access to university administrators than most parents. Matt came here and Sara worked for the women's basketball team for a while. Alan will be next to come. Assuming the decision was left up to Alan then any influence from Matt, his parents, or the CJ coaches didn't discourage him.
It is fine to say you aren't happy with the incidents or the consequences. If you think WSU has handled this the way Florida State has handled their guys then you really must dislike Donlon like you say.
|
|
|
Post by Big D on Oct 18, 2014 13:38:51 GMT -5
Tommy, that is a bunch of malarkey. 7 arrests in 4 years is unacceptable no matter how you feel about the coaching staff.
|
|
|
Post by Retired Coach on Oct 18, 2014 13:49:16 GMT -5
I think Tavares got a raw deal on his 2013 incident. I think he deserved another chance. Maybe it is your intention to discourage players and their families from coming to Wright State. I offer a counter point for them to consider and that would be the Vest family. Mark ( as a former all-time great ) probably has more access to university administrators than most parents. Matt came here and Sara worked for the women's basketball team for a while. Alan will be next to come. Assuming the decision was left up to Alan then any influence from Matt, his parents, or the CJ coaches didn't discourage him. It is fine to say you aren't happy with the incidents or the consequences. If you think WSU has handled this the way Florida State has handled their guys then you really must dislike Donlon like you say. The sad thing is that I don't think Florida State's 83 scholarship football team has had more arrests than our basketball program over the last 4 years. My intention isn't to discourage players and their families from coming to Wright State. Donlon is doing a fine job of that all on his own. I can guarantee you that every coach that we will be recruiting against for future recruits is going to bring up all of these incidents at Wright State. What kind of parent is going to want to let their kid attend a school that AVERAGES almost 2 arrest every year under their head coach. You can keep trying to spin this anyway you want, but that is a major problem for this program.
|
|
|
Post by wsutommygun on Oct 18, 2014 13:52:43 GMT -5
Unless Donlon is hosting drinking parties then I don't know how he is to blame. Do you only want us to recruit at schools that sent us players that never got into trouble? Sorry, it just isn't that simple or any guarantee. Do you want a policy like Raider Country suggests and 10 years down the road apply to someone that did a similar thing in 2014?
Anyway, I think you posted your sentiments previously. In an age when parents don't want you to yell at their precious Johnny or Janie or make them work too hard, I wonder why people stay in the profession.
Pretty soon we'll only talk about basketball.
I don't facebook or twitter, I am 99% sure I'd be fussing with a kid or two at least 9 out of every 10 days. They know but, may not be thinking of me at posting time.
|
|
|
Post by Black PantherU on Oct 18, 2014 15:54:41 GMT -5
According to JJ Boggs on twitter, this is the 4th arrest this offseason.
|
|
|
Post by Sixth Man on Oct 18, 2014 18:10:04 GMT -5
According to JJ Boggs on twitter, this is the 4th arrest this offseason. No shit. That has already been pretty well documented over the last 3 pages of this thread.
|
|