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Post by Cheerfan on Sept 5, 2012 6:07:12 GMT -5
Not necessarily Football. Oral Roberts is dropping to the Southland from the Summit. Why? They'll practically be guaranteed tourney appearances and the travel budget is a lot nicer. There are maybe 1-2 other examples like that in the last 10 years, but for every example of a school moving down there are 50 examples of schools moving up in conferences. Very very few make the decision to move down in conferences unless they are forced to or they need to because of finances. I don't think you are going to find an example of a team from a top 10 conference like the A-10 or MVC moving down voluntarily.
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Post by Sixth Man on Sept 12, 2012 10:19:16 GMT -5
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Post by Hoops Junkie on Sept 17, 2012 7:18:00 GMT -5
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Post by Raider Pride on Sept 27, 2012 18:54:49 GMT -5
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Post by Jazzfan on Sept 27, 2012 20:11:31 GMT -5
I think Jimmy is just throwing crap up against the wall and seeing what sticks.
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Post by Big D on Sept 30, 2012 11:44:18 GMT -5
I wouldn't say that. I think Jimmy just jumped the gun a little bit and didn't really present it the best way. He should have put together a well thought out blog story or just a post on one of the message boards instead of announcing it on twitter and explained that those are the 3 names he is hearing the most. The way it came across on twitter, people were thinking he was announcing that it is some sort of done deal and it is no where close to a done deal. I keep hearing 5 names: Oakland, Belmont, Evansville, Murray St, and Robert Morris. Here are the RUMORS I hear about each school. (and I want to emphasize all of this is based on rumors).
Oakland: Oakland wants in. They made it known in the media months ago. The HL wants them in. Well I should say 7 of 9 HL schools want them in or 6 of 9 do. Detroit and Loyola have been holding this up and I hear Valpo might/might not be part of that. Detroit doesn't want them in and Loyola has been backing them up based on old loyalties between the 2 schools. I hear that Oakland will be invited. I hear the rest of the HL has compromised with Detroit and Loyola and agreed to go after 2 private schools if they agree to let Oakland in. I think Valpo is fine with Oakland being part of the HL, but I hear they have been part of that discussion because they also want the HL to go after some private schools (specifically Evansville). Oakland is important to most HL schools. We want a good basketball program first and foremost. They also have a baseball team which is a priority and they give the HL another presence in Michigan which we wanted. HL teams like to recruit Michigan but have not had the success there they would like. Having 2 local schools should help with Michigan recruiting. Oakland gives Detroit a natural travel partner and a built in rival. They also give Valpo a good rival from their Summit days.
Belmont: Belmont offers everything the HL wants except for their location. They have a really good basketball program, baseball team, facilities, fan base, and they spend money on sports. They are one of the few good mid-majors out there without football, so we never have to worry about them jumping conferences based on a football move. They also give us a presence in a new state which opens up a new area for recruiting. From Belmont's side, they have legit interest. They are just entering their first year in the OVC, but the OVC is a much lower rated conference than the HL. The OVC is a 20-25 ranked conference that gets bad NCAA seeds and never gets at large bids. The HL is a 10-15 ranked conference that can get decent seeds and has been able to get at large bids. Travel is an issue, but if the HL divides into 2 six team divisions that travel can be managed. Nashville is also an easy city to travel to by major highways and airfare there is cheap. If we add Evansville, they are only a 2.5 hr drive away which just gave them a travel partner in the HL.
Evansville: Evansville is the team we have to go after to appease Detroit, Loyola and Valpo. They were once in the HL and were a major player in the conference. They moved to the MVC 18 years ago when the HL went through our last major shakeup. I don't think they wanted to leave then. I think they left out of fear that the conference was going under and they didn't want to be left in the dark. They have been in the MVC for 18 years and have struggled in that conference. Their budget is under 10 million a year which is well below most MVC schools. That is a decent budget for the HL though. They have also struggled to develop any rivalries in the MVC. They still have 2 rivals in Loyola and Detroit from their MCC days. They also have an old rivalry with Valpo. They could be ready to come back to the HL because of fear that the MVC is ready for a major shake up. Creighton is being courted by the A-10 and several of their football schools have been looking at their football options. They could very well be ready to move on before they are left in the dark in that conference. From a HL standpoint, they haven't had the kind of success we have been looking for, but they do have some good selling points. They have good potential to improve when they get into the HL. They just built great facilities for basketball. They have a good budget for a HL team. They give us a second presence in the state of Indiana which is huge for the HL because every HL team likes to recruit in Indiana.
Murray St: Murray St is the team most HL fans want and honestly I think most HL schools would prefer them too but the HL will go after Evansville first. If Evansville turns us down I think Murray State would be next on the list. The upside of Murray State is that they have a great basketball team with a good name brand to sell because of their success. They have a baseball team, good facilities, and spend money on their athletics. The downside to them is their location, they have football, and they are not private. Even though geographically they are closer than Belmont, there is no easy way to get there by flight or by driving. You have to worry about them finding a home for their football team and worry about them eventually leaving the HL for a football conference down the line. And they are not private. I don't know if Loyola, Detroit, and Valpo will agree to them.
Robert Morris: If Robert Morris had a baseball team I think they would be number 2 on our wish list. They are in a good location. They are private. They have a good basketball team. If Evansville turns us down, I wouldn't be surprised to see them invited before Murray State just because they are a private school and make good geographic sense being so close to YSU.
These are the rumors I have been hearing from friends around the HL. Take them for what they are worth.
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Post by Raider Country on Oct 2, 2012 21:42:51 GMT -5
Big D, I have heard many of the rumors you mentioned and a few other ones. The constant theme has been that HL schools have not been looking into what is in the conference's best interest. Each school is too focused on how expansion affects their own school. The sad thing is that none of the schools seem to realize that if we don't get it together and make a decision soon we might lose our biggest selling point with the teams we are trying to attract to the HL--our elevated conference standing. We are selling that the HL is a 10-15 ranked conference and could be even better if they join. If the HL sucks the next year or 2 we lose that selling point. Why would a Summit or OVC program want to join the HL if all of a sudden we drop in the rankings and are ranked similar to those conferences. The clock is ticking. The HL presidents, ADs, and our commissioner need to come together and do what's best for the conference before the conference turns to crap.
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Post by Class of '83 on Oct 3, 2012 6:16:08 GMT -5
Big D, I have heard many of the rumors you mentioned and a few other ones. The constant theme has been that HL schools have not been looking into what is in the conference's best interest. Each school is too focused on how expansion affects their own school. The sad thing is that none of the schools seem to realize that if we don't get it together and make a decision soon we might lose our biggest selling point with the teams we are trying to attract to the HL--our elevated conference standing. We are selling that the HL is a 10-15 ranked conference and could be even better if they join. If the HL sucks the next year or 2 we lose that selling point. Why would a Summit or OVC program want to join the HL if all of a sudden we drop in the rankings and are ranked similar to those conferences. The clock is ticking. The HL presidents, ADs, and our commissioner need to come together and do what's best for the conference before the conference turns to crap. This is what I have been worried about when it comes to HL expansion. We have too many schools looking out for only their best interest and a weak commissioner. That is not a recipe for success.
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Post by wolf41 on Oct 3, 2012 11:10:53 GMT -5
First and foremost I want us to add Oakland. That is a great fit for the HL and gives us a second school from MI in the HL. Next, I'd be very happy with Evansville. That would give the HL a second school in IN now that Butler has moved to the A-10. Third, I would like to see us add Robert Morris for my own selfish reasons, plus us puts the HL in western PA and it is close to YSU as a ttravel partner.
I am less interested in Belmont and Murray State, but would have no objections to them joining the HL. In fact, if their is such an opportunity I'd be happy to add all 5 teams to the HL to give us 14 teams, though I prefer 10 or 12 teams. With 12 teams we could play each team twice a year for 22 games of the required 29. With 14 teams we could play 18 in one year and 20 games in the second year of a two year cycle, or play each team in our division twice and every team in the other division once for a total of 19 games a year.
I think all of these teams would add a lot to the HL, but I especially like the first three for our first adds.
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Post by Big D on Oct 5, 2012 20:18:27 GMT -5
First and foremost I want us to add Oakland. That is a great fit for the HL and gives us a second school from MI in the HL. Next, I'd be very happy with Evansville. That would give the HL a second school in IN now that Butler has moved to the A-10. Third, I would like to see us add Robert Morris for my own selfish reasons, plus us puts the HL in western PA and it is close to YSU as a travel partner. I am less interested in Belmont and Murray State, but would have no objections to them joining the HL. In fact, if their is such an opportunity I'd be happy to add all 5 teams to the HL to give us 14 teams, though I prefer 10 or 12 teams. With 12 teams we could play each team twice a year for 22 games of the required 29. With 14 teams we could play 18 in one year and 20 games in the second year of a two year cycle, or play each team in our division twice and every team in the other division once for a total of 19 games a year. I think all of these teams would add a lot to the HL, but I especially like the first three for our first adds. Wolf, I think your top 3 makes the most sense if the HL wants to keep it's geographic proximity. I do have 2 concerns with those 3 schools though. The HL has to add at least 1 baseball program to keep our automatic qualifying status. Only 2 of those 3 have baseball. I know we only need 1 team but I would be much more comfortable we won't end up in this position again if all 3 schools we add have baseball. The other concern I have is that the HL wants to go to 12 teams to elevate the conference. Our current 9 team conference is a 1 bid type conference. The main reason to go to 12 instead of just 10 is to add enough talent to get the HL to a point where we can consistently be a 2 bid type conference. I don't think those 3 schools improve our conference enough to get us there. If we add 3 teams and are only able to be a 1 bid conference all we are doing is splitting our conference's NCAA tournament money from 9 shares to 12 shares. I don't think any of our ADs want to add teams just to add teams especially if it means we are going to lose money in the process. We need 3 teams that can boost our conference. Evansville does not help us achieve that goal. If we are set on adding them, we need to bring in a top 50 type program like Belmont or Murray State that can help offset them. I think Oakland and or Robert Morris would be solid additions. I see Belmont and Murray State as home runs.
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Post by Raider Grad on Oct 6, 2012 8:13:04 GMT -5
I still have hopes that the HL will go big in expansion in 2 phases. It sounds like currently we want to add Belmont, Evansville, and Oakland. I like those additions. Belmont and Oakland are very good additions. Evansville has potential. I hope we don't end there. I would still love to be able to add 2 more teams to get us to 14. Murray State and Robert Morris makes good sense and would give us a solid 14. I would be happy with 1-2 of the other basketball school in the MVC too if they are an option. I think Big D hit the nail on the head in regards to expansion. We should only go big if it is going to take the HL to the next level. If we are going to go to 14 it should be with the purpose of getting the HL to a point where we are a 2 or even 3 bid conference. More importantly, it should also get us to a point where we can get a better TV contract. If you look at the A-10 as a role model, they just made 3 huge moves as a conference. The obvious ones are the additions of VCU and Butler, but they also negotiated 3 new TV deals for the next 8 years. The details are in the below article. www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/20433855/a10-signs-new-eightyear-television-deal-with-espn-cbs-nbc
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Post by Tipp City Raider on Oct 6, 2012 12:56:06 GMT -5
First and foremost I want us to add Oakland. That is a great fit for the HL and gives us a second school from MI in the HL. Next, I'd be very happy with Evansville. That would give the HL a second school in IN now that Butler has moved to the A-10. Third, I would like to see us add Robert Morris for my own selfish reasons, plus us puts the HL in western PA and it is close to YSU as a ttravel partner. I've been thinking about your top 3 for a few days now and the more I think about them the more I like it. The geography works well. We can keep some of our current travel partners and reconfigure some to make better geographic sense. UWM/GB, and UIC/Loyola would stay the same. Detroit would pair with Oakland. Evansville would pair with Valpo. CSU would pair with us and YSU would pair with Robert Morris. It would strengthen our recruiting in 2 current states: MI and IN. It would also open up the door to recruiting in PA with Robert Morris. I would rather add that area than to add Belmont and the state of TN. PA is a much better state for D1 basketball talent than TN. Travel cost for all HL schools would be better for Robert Morris than they would for Belmont. I also think Robert Morris has more long term potential to stay in the HL than Belmont. Belmont is just too far away from the rest of the conference. They might be willing to make the jump now just to get into a better conference, but I think they will get sick of all of that travel eventually and look for another conference that is a better geographic fit. Robert Morris makes more sense to me for that reason. They are close enough to the OH and MI schools in the HL to probably keep them happy in the HL long term.
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Post by wsutommygun on Oct 6, 2012 13:52:57 GMT -5
I'll be interested to see if the teams mentioned to me end up being the ones that join. I'm not sure why the announcement hasn't been made ( although I can think of a couple of possible reasons ). I do think the lack of talk tells me something ( as in it is probably a done deal ). If the league really wants to wait until after the season then I don't intend to interfere. Although I don't do anything with some of the social media, I truly am surprised by the process.
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Post by Nutt House on Oct 6, 2012 13:56:10 GMT -5
I'll be interested to see if the teams mentioned to me end up being the ones that join. I'm not sure why the announcement hasn't been made ( although I can think of a couple of possible reasons ). I do think the lack of talk tells me something ( as in it is probably a done deal ). If the league really wants to wait until after the season then I don't intend to interfere. Although I don't do anything with some of the social media, I truly am surprised by the process. So what schools are you hearing?
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Post by wsutommygun on Oct 6, 2012 14:34:15 GMT -5
Nutt House, if I did that, wouldn't it be interfering? Safer to just say stick to the speculations or desires in whom you'd like to see ( just don't let it spoil your dinner or sleep ). If a team is announced that wasn't told to me, I'll admit that much ( then you'd wonder about my source and so would I but, they usually know ).
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