League expansion talk again

[wsu97]

IPFW again to make pitch to join league
AD eyes Mid-Con, Horizon
By LaMond Pope
The Journal Gazette

The NCAA Convention begins today in Indianapolis.
For Mark Pope, that means seminars, panel discussions and most importantly a chance to showcase IPFW.
“The primary role is to push conference affiliation for IPFW,” Pope said Thursday. “I’m going to make every effort to meet with those folks.”
Pope, the school’s athletic director, hopes to spend time with officials from the Mid-Continent Conference and the Horizon League in an attempt to move from its current status as an independent.
“They both have nine (teams). We would love to be their 10th, and they know that,” Pope said.
IPFW has focused on a pair of conferences with regional ties. The Mid-Con Conference includes IUPUI, Valparaiso and Western Illinois. The Horizon League features Butler and Loyola-Chicago.
“As with any effort, we will try to make those members aware of what we are doing,” Pope said.
The list of recent highlights for the school includes the Dec. 18 men’s basketball game with Notre Dame that drew 8,957 fans to Memorial Coliseum and Monday’s 54-46 upset at Indiana State.
“The success we had with the Notre Dame game, handling a big crowd and playing a pretty good game. The victory against Indiana State gave us some national attention. We want to spread the word on those things,” he said.
The convention runs through Monday with more than 2,300 delegates registered to attend. Pope’s agenda also consists of gathering with athletics directors from other independent schools to discuss scheduling of games.
He will serve as the school’s delegate for the Division I legislative forum. One proposal to which he’ll vote no is for an increase in the maximum grant-in-aid limitations in women’s gymnastics (12 to 14), women’s volleyball (12 to 13), women’s cross country/track and field (18 to 20) and women’s soccer (12 to 14). The vote takes place Saturday.
The proposal (No. 04-21) was initiated based on research showing an increase in participation in those sports. Pope said the proposal is unfair to Division I-AAA schools (Division I programs that don’t play football).
“On the face, one would think this is great,” Pope said. “(But) they want to offset scholarships that would go to football. We don’t have that issue. It creates a potential disparity where the biggest schools will be able to stockpile the biggest and best athletes.”
Pope fears adding the scholarships would create a situation similar to women’s basketball.
“There is a lack of parity,” he said. “You see the same (top) five teams over and over. The proof is in the pudding. You haven’t seen a Gonzaga (another Division I-AAA school) break free in women’s basketball.
“Part of it is the historical newness of women’s basketball. There is a deeper pool of athletes in men’s basketball. I worry adding would allow the bigger schools to stockpile the talent.”
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www.fortwayne.com/mld/journalgazette/sports/13564375.htm

[Wolf]

IPFW, NDSU, and SDSU have been making this same pitch to join the horizon league for the last 3-4 years. It isn't going to happen.

[Big D]

They have been having this same discussion on the Butler message board since yesterday. Here is what I posted over there. I’d like to see the Horizon League expand the conference and add 2-3 of the following schools:

1. Western Kentucky
They would add a team with some name recognition, success in the NCAAs, and good facilities. They have produced 23 All-Americans, and have made 30 postseason tournament appearances (NIT & NCAA), including 1 Final Four appearance and 5 Sweet Sixteen appearances. They have averaged 4707 fans over the last 5 years. Their average RPI over the last 6 years is 108 (60, 36, 69, 191, 147, 145). They are located in Kentucky, which would expand the borders of the HL while still being a decent geographic fit. They play in the Sun Belt, which is a top 15-20 conference. They are the only school in the Sun Belt that doesn’t play D1 football and the Sun Belt is mainly a southern conference. A move to the HL would be a slight step up for them in overall conference RPI and it would be a much better geographical fit for them.

2. Murray State
They are a team with a long history of NCAA success. They have made 13 NCAA tournament appearances since they went D1. They also have good facilities. They built a new arena in the late 1990s that seats a little under 9,000. They have averaged 4186 fans over the last 5 years. Their average RPI over the last 6 years is 107 (123, 143, 132, 100, 83, 58) . They are located in Kentucky, so they would make a nice travel partner for Western Kentucky and give us 2 schools in that state. They play in the Ohio Valley conference, which is usually a >20 conference. A move to the HL would be a big step up for them.

3. Valparaiso
They also add a team with name recognition and success in the NCAAs. They have a history with several of the HL teams that used to be members of the Mid-Con before they joined the HL. They have made 8 NCAA tournament appearances, including 1 Sweet Sixteen appearance, since they went D1 in 1976. They have averaged 4320 fans over the last 5 years. Their average RPI over the last 6 years is 116 (94, 73, 94, 171, 125, 138) . They are located in Indiana, so they would be a good geographic fit. They play in the Mid-Con, which is usually a >20 conference. A move to the HL would be a big step up for them.

Any of the 3 schools make sense for them and the HL. They get to move to a better conference and we get to add a top ranked team from a lower conference. It is win-win for everyone. Adding a team like IPFW, NDSU, or SDSU will only help that team. For the conference, it will be a huge step back.

[GBFanK]

If the Horizon League decides to expand again, I'd like to see them add three teams. In my opinion, either the 9-team or 12-team league format is the best. Just adding one wouldn't be good, because, chances are, that will be two extra games to the conference schedule, and if a weak team is added, it's two less games to schedule, but two games that could be filled by stronger teams. If it would go to twelve teams, then you can have the two divisions and keep a 16-game schedule. I'm not saying that the HL should do this. I'm just saying that if it's going to happen, this would be the best idea. I don't want to see extra required games that just drag down the conference and teams.

[GBFanJ]

Sorry, misspelled the name on the last one.

[Deleted]

i'd be ok w/ IPFW coming into the conference if we left. their 276 rpi will only hurt us and bring another crappy team into an already struggling conference.

[raider fan]

The addition of YSU has really hurt the HL RPI in the first 5 years ( hopefully things are turning at YSU ). We can NOT afford another 5 plus year drag on our RPI by bringing in IPFWANUHTG or whatever thier name is.

Another RPI anchor and we would officailly become a low major league.

[raider fan]

I need to correct my last post. I meant to say if we add IPFW it will drag us down and we will become a LOW MID MAJOR league.

Big D, do you know or can you find out what our conference RPI was before adding YSU and how adding them has affected our RPI?

[Big D]

1999: 15th
2000: 13th
2001: 11th
2002: 17th (YSU's first year in the HL)
2003: 13th
2004: 15th
2005: 19th
2006: 14th so far

[Big D]

Butler fans have the best reason to hate YSU. The year YSU joined the HL, Butler failed to get an at large bid to the NCAA tournament when they lost the conference tournament. They finished that season 25-5. They had an overall RPI of 77 and a nonconference RPI of 48. YSU had an RPI of 308 that season. If Butler could have scheduled 2 decent mid-majors instead of YSU, they would have had a final RPI in the top 50 and received an at large bid.

Butler went to the NCAA tournament the next year and made it to the sweet 16. that 2002 team was better than their sweet 16 team in my opinion. They had everyone from that sweet 16 team plus Ryan Hainje and Thomas Jackson in 2002. Both of those guys are on Butlers all time scoring list.

www.kenpom.com/conf.php?y=2002&c=Horz

[Class of '83]

raiderd said:

They finished that season 25-5. They had an overall RPI of 77 and a nonconference RPI of 48. YSU had an RPI of 308 that season. If Butler could have scheduled 2 decent mid-majors instead of YSU, they would have had a final RPI in the top 50 and received an at large bid.

Butler would have had a much better chance of getting that into the tournament by losing to two top 75 programs than beating YSU twice. They could have received an invite with a 23-7 record if their RPI was in the top 45-50. This is year 5 of the YSU experiment and we still have not gotten the conference back to where it was before their addition. The horizon league cannot afford to add another anchor like Youngstown State.

[Raider Country]

January 20, 2006
Mastodons join league


Indiana University-Purdue University Fort Wayne has joined five other schools in forming the United Basketball Conference that will begin play a year from now.


All of the schools are making the transition to NCAA Division I and searching for permanent conference membership. The others are South Dakota State, North Dakota State, New Jersey Institute of Technology, Texas-Pan American and Utah Valley State.

www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060120/SPORTS06/601200516/1004/SPORTS

[bballraider]

Although I hope eventually these teams form a league, (to keep them out of ours), currently it is just an alliance for scheduling purposes.

Mastodons join 6-team ‘conference’
By Sarah Trotto
The Journal Gazette (Fort Wayne)

When is a conference not really a conference? When it’s this conference. IPFW and five other independents have formed the United Basketball Conference, an alliance established so their men’s and women’s basketball teams can each play 10 home and away league games starting next season. North Dakota State, South Dakota State, New Jersey Institute of Technology, Texas-Pan-American and Utah Valley State are also members.

“We will not petition the NCAA for conference status,” IPFW athletic director Mark Pope said.

Pope said despite the alliance, he is still working to get IPFW into a conference. He has been in contact with the Mid-Continent Conference and the Horizon League....

for the rest of the story:
www.fortwayne.com/mld/journalgazette/sports/13670801.htm

[Deleted]

as a poster on our board said, we look forward to the border battle between New Jersey Institute of Technology & Utah Valley State.

[jfarrell04]

North Dakota State beat #15 Wisconsin today!!