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Post by Raider Country on Mar 17, 2006 7:21:16 GMT -5
Updated: March 16, 2006, 9:12 PM ET Orr's future with Seton Hall uncertain after lossBy Andy Katz ESPN.com GREENSBORO, N.C. -- Seton Hall is expected to decide Louis Orr's fate as coach in the next few weeks. But Orr might decide it for the Pirates. Orr has two seasons remaining on a seven-year contract. Seton Hall athletic director Joe Quinlan said following the Pirates' first-round NCAA Tournament loss to Wichita State Thursday that he will review the season with Orr when they return to New Jersey. He didn't say he would do anything either way, as in an extension or termination or just let Orr ride out the two years. Yet Orr, who has coached the Pirates to two NCAA Tournaments in the past three seasons, made it sound like he hasn't decided what he wants to do. "Right now I'm the head coach of Seton Hall," Orr told ESPN.com in the hallway outside his locker room at the Greensboro Coliseum. "I've got to talk to my family, do a lot of praying and seek godly counsel. I've got to talk to the Lord. I don't know. I'm the coach of Seton Hall and that's what I'm looking for in the future. I've got two years left and what happens from here God only knows." Orr's job status has been questioned throughout the past year after the Pirates finished 12-16 last season, 4-12 in the Big East. Seton Hall was picked to finish 15th in the preseason Big East coaches poll. Yet, despite losing by a combined 95 points to Connecticut and Duke, the Pirates were able to rally themselves to finish 18-11 overall, 9-7 in the Big East. Seton Hall rallied for huge wins at NC State, Syracuse and Pitt, wins that essentially earned it its NCAA bid. At least one source close to the staff told ESPN.com Thursday that "they" -- meaning influential boosters and high-level administrators -- want Orr and the staff to be more social, be more out in the community of alumni, and basically be something that they are not, since they are most concerned with simply coaching the team. "I don't know," Orr said of what he was going to do. "I need time to sort things out and talk to my family and coaches and do a lot of praying. I need time to sort stuff out. Time will tell." When asked if he wants to finish the remaining two years of his contract, Orr said, "That's part of my stewardship." The Pirates lose their top two scorers -- seniors Kelly Whitney and Donald Copeland off this team. When asked what he thought of Seton Hall going to two of the last three NCAAs, Quinlan responded without mentioning Orr (whether it was intentional or not) by saying, "I think it's a great accomplishment and a real tribute to the team and how hard they worked." Orr may decide to pursue another job, possibly in his native Ohio like Cincinnati or Wright State, if Seton Hall doesn't offer him an extension. Firing Orr seems to be a reach considering his success. But Quinlan may choose to simply stay the course and let Orr ride out the next two years, or at least the next season. Regardless, the players have seen the pressure put on Orr, who in five years has taken the Pirates to three postseasons (two NCAAs and an NIT). "He's handled it with a great deal of dignity and courage," Whitney said. "He's one of the finest guys I've ever met in my life. He's done a lot for me and this program. He took a team that was picked 15th and stayed on us. Look at his résumé. He's a good coach who has been to the postseason three of the past four years." Andy Katz is a senior writer at ESPN.com. sports.espn.go.com/ncb/ncaatourney06/news/story?id=2371721&campaign=rss&source=NCBHeadlines |
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Post by Raider Country on Mar 17, 2006 7:23:59 GMT -5
Louis Orr Head Coach Syracuse '80 A committed and passionate teacher of young people, head coach Louis Orr enters his fifth season at Seton Hall. Orr’s tenure has been highlighted by a dedication to defensive intensity and fostering a family atmosphere. He is known and respected for his character, honesty and sincere care for his student-athletes. As a former NBA player with the New York Knicks and Indiana Pacers, he brings his knowledge and first-hand experience directly to his players to make them better people, students and ambassadors for their sport. Over the past several seasons, Seton Hall has been one of the best defensive teams in the nation, and one of the tougher opponents to face night in and night out. All of this can be attributed to Orr’s competitiveness that permeates his program and gets the most out of his players. The Pirates under Orr are blue-collar, humble and tenacious. Despite 2004-05’s 12-16 record, the future is bright in South Orange. Orr has stockpiled an impressive array of talent on the roster that should in short time turn the close losses of that year into victories. In 2003-04, the Pirates had their most successful season in Orr’s tenure, going 21-10 and advancing to the second round of the NCAA Tournament. Fans appreciated Seton Hall’s combination of work ethic and breathtaking talent, and were rewarded with some of the most rousing victories in recent memory at Continental Airlines Arena. The Pirates went 10-6 in the very difficult BIG EAST Conference for the second straight year, and earned a No. 8 seed in the NCAA Tournament. Seton Hall’s 80-76 opening-round win over perennial powerhouse and favored Arizona was one for the ages. Most importantly, Orr’s vision for the Seton Hall basketball program as an extended family has been fulfilled. At Seton Hall, all of the tools are in place for a student-athlete to grow as a basketball player, a student and a person. Orr, being deeply committed to each of his student-athletes, has earned a reputation as a coach of integrity and trust. It is a reputation that has followed Orr wherever he has coached and continues to spread among everyone he meets in the Seton Hall community. When Orr took over the Seton Hall program in April of 2001, he inherited a team that lost two players to the NBA. While convincing the talented players who remained to believe in his system and vision, the Pirates quickly returned to the national radar, culminating in 2003-04’s NCAA run. Orr’s philosophy on the court revolves around a commitment to defense and effort. In 2002-03, Orr took a team which owned a sub-.500 record and an 0-3 BIG EAST mark in the first two months and molded it into one that was one of the nation’s hottest down the stretch. The Pirates won nine games in a row, for the school’s longest streak since 1992-93, and captured eight consecutive BIG EAST contests. Seton Hall won 10 conference games and posted its second winning league campaign since ‘92-93. The Pirates had a 16-11 regular season record, which is the most victories at the end of the regular season since 1999-00, and finished the season with a 17-13 mark. Orr was honored by the BIG EAST as the 2003 Coach of the Year and owns the distinction of being the first former BIG EAST player to coach at a conference institution and then win the top honor. The Pirate mentor was also named the District II Coach of the Year by the United States Basketball Writers Association. One June 23, 2003, the New Jersey State Legislature sponsored a joint resolution honoring him for his accomplishments. In 2001-02, the team’s 12-18 record against a high level of competition was not indicative of its level of play as the Pirates took top-ranked Duke to the wire in the nationally-televised Maui Invitational and had seven losses by four points or less. Orr became the 17th head coach in Seton Hall history on April 4, 2001, joining the Pirates after serving as the head coach at Siena College in 2000-01. He brought more than 10 years of experience in the collegiate coaching ranks, including tenures as an assistant coach at BIG EAST Conference schools Syracuse and Providence. He owns the distinction of being the first former BIG EAST player to be named a head coach at a conference institution. In his first season at Siena, Orr led the Saints to a 20-11 record while posting a 12-6 record in Metro Atlantic Athletic Conference play to finish in a three-way tie for the regular season title. With 20 victories, he became the winningest rookie coach in Siena history, while also recording one of the highest number of wins for a first-year coach in the nation during 2000-01. His Siena team also broke the program’s attendance record, averaging over 6,400 fans per game. Prior to taking his first head coaching job, the native of Cincinnati, Ohio, served as an assistant coach for 10 seasons, at Syracuse, Providence and Xavier. He began his collegiate coaching career in 1990, as a volunteer assistant coach at Xavier University. After two seasons, he accepted a full-time position with the Musketeers for 1993-94, while helping Xavier go 59-30 with post-season trips all three years. He moved on to Providence College, serving as the head assistant coach on Pete Gillen’s staff for two seasons, from 1994 to 1996. The Friars advanced to the NIT both years while posting a combined 35-25 record. Orr then returned to his alma mater, Syracuse, and was an assistant coach for four years, from 1996 to 2000. During his tenure there, the Orangemen compiled a 92-40 record, reached the NIT once and the NCAA Tournament for three consecutive years, with two appearances in the Sweet 16. During his playing career at Syracuse from 1976 to 1980, Orr helped the Orangemen to NCAA Tournaments appearances each year, with two berths in the Sweet 16, while earning All-America honors in 1980. He finished his career as one of the top rebounders in school history with 881 and led the team in 1979-80 with 8.5 per game. He was honored by the University in 1990 with the Vic Hanson Medal of Excellence. Upon graduation from Syracuse in 1980, the Cincinnati, Ohio, native was the 28th pick in the 1980 NBA Draft by the Indiana Pacers. After two seasons with the Pacers, which included one playoff appearance, he moved on to the New York Knicks, and played for six years, with three playoff berths. In 1984-85, Orr averaged career highs in points and rebounds for the Knicks with 12.7 and 4.9, respectively. He scored over 5,500 career points as a pro. Orr, 47, and his wife, Yvette, have two children, Chauncey (12) and Monica (22), who played basketball at Fordham University., and a God-daughter, Dalria (22). www.shupirates.com/sports/mbball/bio.asp?PLAYER_ID=952 |
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Post by NorthJerseycom on Mar 17, 2006 9:14:06 GMT -5
Pirates must make a hard decision on Orr
Friday, March 17, 2006
By ADRIAN WOJNAROWSKI
SPORTS COLUMNIST
GREENSBORO, N.C. -- Joe Quinlan has always been the invisible man, the Mr. Smithers in the shadows of small schools, the faceless NCAA offices, the busy-bee of Bob Mulcahy's Meadowlands and Rutgers administrations. He was always talking into a walkie-talkie, running around a football press box with his hand pressed to an earpiece. Yes, the busybody bureaucrat.
He's never had to stand there, take the tough questions and make an executive decision. Finally, it's time.
Quinlan was standing in the hallway outside the Seton Hall locker room at the Greensboro Coliseum, his royal blue Seton Hall tie and a face still blushing Rutgers red. He was doing his usual say-nothing dance that ultimately says so much. Louis Orr isn't his guy, and never will be. His public silence speaks volumes. Now, Quinlan gets to carry out the mandate delivered him upon his hiring at the Hall. Fire Orr and hire a coach. If nothing else, he needs to make a decision.
After Wichita State pounded Seton Hall, 86-66, on Thursday, Orr's boss was thrown an easy one, a gold-plated opportunity to say something nice about his basketball coach.
Two NCAA tournaments in three years, Quinlan was asked.
What do you think of that?
"It's a great accomplishment and a real tribute to the team and how hard they worked," Quinlan said.
The athletic director has carefully chosen his words for months, and he chose them carefully when the season was finally over. He had a chance to praise Orr. He didn't do it. He never does, and never will. He has thrown out some line of garbage about meeting with Orr, discussing the season and completing his "evaluation" of the coach and program. This so-called evaluation was completed a long time ago, back when Quinlan was busily polling everyone from college coaches to administrators for names he should be thinking about for his next basketball coach.
"You want to be where you're wanted, where you're appreciated for who you are," Orr told The Record.
Orr isn't wanted at the Hall. And he knows it. This was never a good fit, but Orr is a good man, a good coach and belongs in college basketball. If I was an AD at Wright State, I'd hire him in a second over Gary Waters. Somewhere, there's a program that fits him. Seton Hall isn't it. The Hall would pay a steep price of decline for keeping him on the job -- empty recruiting classes, empty arenas and empty successes.
Quinlan insisted that he's running the show now, that it won't be Monsignor Sheeran, nor Senator Richard Codey, nor the influential money men at Seton Hall making the ultimate call on Orr. Whatever happens, Quinlan needs to make a stand. This is his chance to start distancing himself from Bob Mulcahy and his Keystone Cops years at Rutgers.
Quinlan needs to show himself a strong, decisive leader. Just make a decision, and get this pall gone from over the program and get moving.
For Quinlan to stand there and say that he had no preconceived ideas about Orr and his program when he arrived, that all he knew about Seton Hall was what he would see in the two games a year that Rutgers played Seton Hall, has been an insult to everyone's intelligence. For him to rail against the perception that Orr was on the way out, that this didn't reflect his reality, is downright disingenuous.
Yet, here's the thing, too: If Orr walked into Quinlan's office today and told him that he was going to make changes on his staff, that he would consent to wholesale changes on his coaching staff, someone who could combat Fred Hill in the state, who can walk into St. Anthony's and St. Patrick's, St. Benedict's and Seton Hall Prep with some credibility, he could keep his job.
Orr should call Jose Rebimbas, the marvelous young coach at William Paterson and a former Pirate under P.J Carlesimo and, say, Murray State's Darren Savino, a St. Anthony High School graduate and an experienced Northeast recruiter. Just a couple of guys like that could get them back into the Jersey recruiting game, get them into doors that the staff's negligence has closed to them.
The thing is, Orr will never do it. He wouldn't do it for deposed A.D. Jeff Fogelson -- never mind Quinlan.
Listen, there is something wrong when the Hall staff waited until one week ago to make a call to St. Benedict's about senior point guard Eugene Harvey. After all, Harvey is one of the best point guards in the nation, plays his high school ball 15 minutes from the campus. To think that they could get involved with a kid of that caliber, this late in his senior year, is beyond belief.
Now, the Hall must imagine what happens to this program with Donald Copeland and Kelly Whitney graduating. Even with them on Thursday, Wichita State blew the Hall out of the building. Outside of Copeland, Wichita State was better at every position and far deeper on the bench.
They're going to be bad next year -- really, really bad -- and that's a fact. The young players in the program are far below Big East standards. Yes, Donald Copeland made immense progress, but he is a rare kid with a rare high school pedigree. Mostly, they have bad freshmen and sophomores who will become mediocre upperclassmen.
Seton Hall will always have cyclical success. This isn't the problem. People could live with two NCAA tournament berths in three years, and then a couple of years of regenerating the program, a losing season or two, an NIT, whatever. The problem is this: Orr's staff is so lightly regarded, commands so little respect in metropolitan circles, it has to be addressed. This isn't about rewarding Orr for wildly overachieving this season, but deciding whether this program has positioned itself to regenerate in the next few years.
To listen to Orr, he sounded resigned to his fate. "I'm still the coach of Seton Hall," he said, refusing to go so far as to say that he still wants to be the coach. What he needs to do is keep his agent on the phone with athletic directors, get himself an interview at a Wright State, a Ball State, a mid-major where he can get some security, some peace of mind.
This is going to end soon. It can't go on this way -- not for Orr, not for Seton Hall. As cruel as it sounds, if Orr has to be somewhere where he's wanted, he needs to move on. Now, the busybody comes out of the shadows and into the light. This is his show, he says. His call.
"I believe I'm going to have a significant investment in this whole process," Quinlan said in his polished bureaucrat verbiage.
So step up, be a leader and make the call. Joe Quinlan gets to make the hard choice that his old boss at Rutgers never wanted to do. Only the future of Seton Hall in the Big East Conference rides on it.
E-mail: wojnarowski@northjersey.com
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Post by Raider Country on Mar 24, 2006 19:36:34 GMT -5
Seton Hall fires coach Orr with two years left on contract March 24, 2006 CBS SportsLine.com wire reports SOUTH ORANGE, N.J. -- Seton Hall fired basketball coach Louis Orr on Friday, a little more than a week after the Pirates lost by 20 points in the opening round of the NCAA Tournament. Orr was 80-69 in five seasons and had two years left on his contract. Athletic director Joe Quinlan on Friday cited recruiting and management of the basketball program as two areas of disagreement. Orr had been criticized for not having a better recruiting record in the New York-New Jersey area. Seton Hall has no recruits signed for next season. "Recruiting is a constant process you have to be involved in," Quinlan said. "I firmly believe it's important to have a strong presence in the metropolitan area." Orr led the Pirates to the NCAA Tournament twice and to the NIT in 2003, when he was honored as Big East Coach of the Year. But he came under fire after finishing 12-16 (4-12 in the Big East) a year ago, and his status was considered tenuous after Quinlan was hired last September. Quinlan met with Orr on Tuesday to review the season. "I did not come in with preconceived notions when I came here," Quinlan said. "We went in to review what happened this season. Following the meeting, I made the decision we would not offer an extension." Seton Hall finished 18-12, defeating Top 25 teams Pittsburgh and West Virginia late in the season. However, those wins were balanced by consecutive losses to lesser teams Notre Dame, St. John's and DePaul, as well as a 61-48 loss to Rutgers in the first round of the Big East Tournament. Those defeats nearly cost the Pirates a bid to the NCAA Tournament, but Seton Hall was picked as a No. 10 seed and lost 86-66 to Wichita State in the first round on March 16. Players learned of Quinlan's decision Friday at a meeting with Orr, in the same room where they'd experienced euphoria less than two weeks earlier while watching the NCAA selection show. "You hear all types of things and you try to not listen to it," junior forward Stan Gaines said. "I was shocked when he told us this morning. I enjoyed playing for him. I don't know what standard he's being judged by, but I can say nothing but good things about him." Senior guard Donald Copeland said Orr didn't let the uncertainty surrounding him affect his dealings with players. "For all the adversity he faced this year, he never once made it about him, it was always about the team," Copeland said. "Considering all the circumstances he was under, I can only imagine that was extremely hard." Before coaching Seton Hall, Orr led Siena to a 20-11 record and a tie for first in the Metro Atlantic Athletic Conference in 2000-01. He played at Syracuse from 1976-80 and then for eight years in the NBA with the Indiana Pacers and New York Knicks. AP NEWS www.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/9333772 |
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Post by raider fan on Mar 24, 2006 20:45:45 GMT -5
The line in the article that jumped out at me was........."empty recruiting classes, empty arenas and empty successes".
Everybody is saying he was "a nice guy", sound familiar? They say "he'd be better off a a smaller instiution", sound familiar?
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New Jersey Daily Record
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Post by New Jersey Daily Record on Mar 25, 2006 10:56:21 GMT -5
Orr's tour terminated
Lack of NYC recruiting has Seton Hall searching for a new coach
BY JERRY CARINO
GANNETT NEW JERSEY
In the end, not even an NCAA tournament berth could keep Louis Orr in South Orange.
Seton Hall University fired the fifth-year men's basketball coach Friday, an expected but bizarre ending to a sometimes fruitful, often uncomfortable partnership.
In a conference call with reporters, Seton Hall athletic director Joe Quinlan indicated that lack of recruiting and inattention to "programmatic details" were the main reasons behind Orr's dismissal.
The search for a new coach is underway, and sources close to the program indicate that Hofstra coach Tom Pecora and Manhattan coach Bobby Gonzalez are at the top of the list.
Orr, who had two years left on his contract, was making a base salary of $499,000 per year.
Quinlan said the university was "going to fulfill the remaining terms of Louis' contract." If Orr gets another coaching job, the university will be off the hook for a portion of the money.
Orr's departure closes a saga that has left much of the college basketball world scratching its head. In a bottom-line business, Orr's bottom line was pretty good: NCAA tournament appearances in 2004 and 2006 and a Big East Coach of the Year honor in 2003, when the Pirates won 17 games and narrowly missed making the Big Dance.
His record over five years was 80-69. In the history of the program, only P.J. Carlesimo took the Pirates to more NCAA tournaments.
But Orr never saw eye to eye with the school's power brokers, who wanted him to raise his recruiting profile in the metropolitan area and do more to promote the program among boosters, alumni and the community.
"We want somebody who is going to be attentive to programmatic details," Quinlan said. "We want somebody who is going to be strong in relationships with recruiting bases in the metropolitan area. Those are two very important aspects."
With a swirl of rumors surrounding his future since the summer, Orr was unable to recruit anyone for next year's freshmen class.
"I believe that recruiting is a constant process that you have to be involved in no matter where you are, no matter who you are," Quinlan said. "I firmly believe it is important for us to have a very strong and visible presence in the metropolitan area in regards to recruiting."
Those were the major sticking points when Quinlan met with Orr Tuesday to review his status.
Several sources said Orr could have saved his job by shaking up his coaching staff to bring in a proven metropolitan-area recruiter -- something the steadfastly loyal coach refused to consider. Quinlan said he never gave an ultimatum to that effect, but sources say the conditions were understood by both parties.
Rise and fall
The Orr era reached its zenith in 2003-04, when the Pirates won 21 games, including a double-overtime victory over No. 4 Pittsburgh at home. They earned a No. 8 seed in the NCAA Tournament, in which they rallied from a 14-point deficit to stun first-round opponent Arizona before falling to Duke two days later.
But Orr squandered any good will he accrued after the 2004 season with a series of missteps.
After a loss at Northwestern the following December, he took the team straight to the airport instead of its scheduled destination -- a Chicago-area alumni banquet honoring former Pirate great Adrian Griffin.
The rest of the 2004-05 season featured a spate of suspensions, including a season-ending one for junior guard J.R. Morris, who failed out of school. A month after the 12-16 campaign ended, talented freshman guard Justin Cerasoli transferred, citing a lack of communication with Orr.
Then Orr's top assistant, Brian Nash, left to take the head job at St. Francis (N.Y.). Rather than bring an experienced local recruiter onto the staff, Orr promoted administrative assistant George Jackson.
Jackson, an old friend of Orr's, was a lightning rod of controversy. In 2001 he was involved in a well-documented locker room scuffle with guard Desmond Herod. Those close to the program say that incident shut off Seton Hall from being able to recruit a good portion of New York City's talent-laden AAU circuit, of which Herod was an alumnus.
In addition, as administrative assistant, Jackson was in charge of overseeing players'academic progress. Yet two starters were forced to serve long-term academic suspensions under his watch.
As a whole, Orr and his assistants struggled to lay strong New York/New Jersey recruiting pipelines.
Seton Hall's previous coach, Tommy Amaker, invited a rotating group of prominent high school coaches from the region to his office each week for lunch and "chalk talk." Orr discontinued the process after getting the job, according to two people associated with the program.
Orr nearly was fired last summer, but university brass elected to switch athletic directors instead and wait to see what unfolded on the court in 2005-06.
Much to the amazement of everyone -- including Big East coaches, who picked the Pirates to finish 15th in the preseason -- Orr led the Hall back to the NCAA tournament thanks to road wins over ranked opponents N.C. State, Syracuse and Pittsburgh.
But the season ended with a thud. The Pirates got pummeled by Rutgers in the Big East Tournament and Wichita State in the NCAA tournament. After the latter loss, Orr seemed resigned to his fate, telling reporters, "You want to be where you're wanted, where you're appreciated for who you are."
Seton Hall's players, who have been dealing with questions about Orr's future for the last few months, were generally upset when informed of the news by Orr on Friday morning.
"I don't know what standards and what ramifications he's being judged by," junior forward Stan Gaines said. "All I can say is nothing but good things about him and I enjoyed being around him for the last couple of years."
Orr was known to be well-liked by most of his players.
"We're all brothers and our father is leaving to go somewhere else," Gaines said. "There were tears. There were positive things, too, because Lou is leaving us with a lot positive things he's instilled in us since he's been coaching us."
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Post by Raider Country on Mar 25, 2006 11:43:27 GMT -5
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Post by Spicy Toast on Mar 26, 2006 10:48:49 GMT -5
From the East Coast rumorville, New Jersey Nets are considering to let go Lawrence Frank in favor of Louis Orr.
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Post by Guest on Mar 26, 2006 11:11:19 GMT -5
The Nets can have him!
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Post by Big D on Mar 27, 2006 15:20:07 GMT -5
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Post by Wolf on Mar 27, 2006 19:29:07 GMT -5
I doubt either player would pass on the Big East to play in the Horizon League.
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Post by Spicy Toast on Mar 27, 2006 19:41:44 GMT -5
On the other hand, Mark Anderson from Dunbar was selecting between Seton Hall and Wright State.
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Post by wsu97 on Mar 27, 2006 19:45:24 GMT -5
On the other hand, Mark Anderson from Dunbar was selecting between Seton Hall and Wright State. It would probably benefit him to have a scholarship offer from one of those schools before he makes that decision. |
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Post by WSUGRAD on Mar 27, 2006 22:30:57 GMT -5
Mark Anderson is going to go to Sinclair.
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Post by Raider Country on Mar 27, 2006 22:45:29 GMT -5
Where did you hear that?
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